Answers from Mr. Enlightenment

Mr. Enlightenment, Jeffrey Chappell

Now that our latest contest is complete, we are all winners. Cosmic drumroll !!!!!!!!!

Mr. Enlightenment has answered a whole lot of questions from our previous contest, “Ask Mr. Enlightenment.”

Not only is a full transcript below. We have a great supplement. For those of you who enjoy HEARING the voice of an Enlightened human, someone who also happens to be a professional musician and has a glorious voice, guess what?  An audio file is included as well. Click here for \”Ask Mr. Enlightenment\” interview with Jeffrey Chappell and Rose Rosetree.

Listen to the first audio file ever at Deeper Perception Made Practical. Or simply keep on reading. Questions from the blog contest have their own headings. (A few questions from Rose slipped in, too, but I didn’t give them headings.) Just couldn’t resist following up. A little light editing was done for the sake of flow.

Thanks so much to everyone who submitted questions. And thanks for understanding that we didn’t have time to respond to every one of them. I chose those with the most universal applicability for all you Blog-Buddies.

RR: Ask Mr. Enlightenment. That’s what we’re doing, Jeffrey Chappell!

JC: Hi, Rose!

RR: Hi. Yes, it’s Rose Rosetree and I’m interviewing you with questions posed at my blog in order to just find out things that people want to know the most. And this, I should mention at the outset, is a supplement to a book you actually wrote and published called “Answers From Silence.” So this is not attempting to duplicate what is in that fabulously helpful book, but more practical questions that people have had about you. And so here we go.

JC: Sounds great.

Do you dream any more in a symbolic way?

(Comment 13 from Primrose)

JC: Yes, sometimes I do have dreams like that. And I also have all the other sorts of dreams that are just plain silliness and totally forgettable. There hasn’t been a big change in that facet of living.

RR: Do you have wakefulness during the dream state?

JC: Sometimes I do. Sometimes I’ll think what a wonderful creation of my mind the dream is while I’m dreaming it. Sometimes I’ll be more or less awake in the dream. But it’s not a skill that I am trying to hone or increase or that I take a lot of note of. It’s just something that happens once in awhile.

RR: You know, I wonder if as we talk, if it will come up in context like this that there are things that some people think of as the ultimate path to Enlightenment, or the equivalent of Enlightenment, that are not necessarily a big deal… to particular specimens of Enlightenment like you, huh?

JC: Well, I think that are a lot of ideas that people have about what enlightenment is and what it should be, and I don’t know that those are always the accurate kind of ideas to have about it.

RR: Well, what’s the very first kind of definition that you’d like to put out there in our conversation now?

JC: I think the main element of enlightenment is a change of identity. Enlightenment is about identity.

Enlightenment is not about being in a good mood all the time, or anything like that. It’s not about the sudden appearance of supernatural powers. It’s none of that. The central issue, the way I see it, is identity.

How crowded is it in there, Mr. Enlightenment?

(Comment 13 from Primrose)

RR: In terms of your own identity and your subconscious mind or what might be called your unconscious mind, is there a lot in it now? Did you gain access to it in a different way after you became unenlightened?

JC: I’ve noticed nothing there at all in terms of aspects that would answer that question. In other words, it’s not a region that pulls my attention in any way, shape, or form. The question on the blog was if my unconscious was, I think, something like calm…

RR: …and quiet.

JC: Yeah. That’s a very accurate description.

RR: Are you interested in unconscious or subconscious phenomena in other people compared to before you became enlightened?

JC: No, not any more than I used to be.

RR: And how would you rank that interest?

JC: Well, you know, I went through times when I would keep dream journals for myself, I went through training in different kinds of counseling people as well as alternative healing methods, so in those regards you might say that I had that kind of interest in the unconscious and so forth.

In dreaming, of course, a lot of the time that is the unconscious speaking to us and giving us messages and expressing what is going on in our lives in a symbolic way and so forth. And in terms of alternative healing, that would mean bringing things to awareness, bringing to consciousness things that were formerly unconscious for someone; as well as the releasing oneself from being stuck in time, particularly being stuck in the past.

So in those ways, I have brushed up against this topic. At the same time, it’s not a major, central focus for me at this point.

RR: So, Mr. Enlightenment, you made an allusion to healing modalities, and I wonder with the kind of identity that you have as someone who is Enlightened, how do you view your role when you facilitate healing now?

JC: I view it the same way I did when I was trained in it, which is to say my role is to exactly do that, which is to facilitate the moving forward of that person’s evolution in whatever way is coming up spontaneously at that time.

Vanished birth trauma?

(Comment 13, still from Primrose.)

RR: What happened to your birth trauma (and any traumas during childhood)?

  • Did it fall away?
  • Was it felt and cleared quickly?
  • Or did you feel connected to Source and not have to go through it at a certain point?

JC: I’m sure I went through it, and out of the three choices given in that question, the one that feels like the bullseye to me is the ‘falling away’ option.

RR: Falling away with insight, or falling away like a dog shaking water off of itself when it came out of the pond?

JC: Like a dog shaking water off.

RR: Not relevant to your identity and experience in the present?

JC: Right.

Sexy Enlightenment

(Comment 31 from Jordan, also Comment 32 from Carol Mories and Comment 36 from Heather Crawford)

What is sex? What is the big deal? Are you at all interested in sex personally?

JC: Well, that’s a great question. And I’ll directly answer the question and then kind of add a context to it.

What is sex? I think that it is one of our most powerful energies that we have as human beings. And I don’t see that there’s any contradiction or conflict between having a powerful sexual nature and a powerful spiritual nature. Let’s see, did I answer the question yet?

RR: Are you interested in sex personally, or did it just end when you became Enlightened?

JC: Enlightenment doesn’t stop you from being human. Everything that is human about you is still right there on the scene and is still happening. I’ve always had a powerful energy that way, so it’s still there.

RR: Well, back at identity, one incentive for sharing sexual energy with another person, especially someone you love, is that there might be a shift to your sense of identity doing that. And has that altered?

Was that the case before, is that the case now, or do you have no idea what on earth I mean?

JC: I will say that the crux of the question is again the question of identity. It’s not that sex in itself is a particular topic that gets a certain kind of attention. It’s just one more of the phenomena that take place, and all of those phenomena are on equal footing.

So, in terms of identity, what happens in Enlightenment is that identity goes to that which is changeless, that which is timeless, that which is eternal. It doesn’t matter what the circumstance is, the identity remains the same.

So that means that an Enlightened person would be just as changelessly Enlightened during one activity as during another activity.

RR: Choosing activities, then, would you say that for the Enlightened person…  if you are having a wonderful session of making love, would that be exactly on the same scale of interest to you as vacuuming the carpet?

JC: Well, no. Vacuuming the carpet is obviously something that is more of a mundane activity. But you know this really goes to the question of what happens to your relationships after Enlightenment happens.

And I remember at first being very confused about as to what it was going to be like.

“Here I am, this reborn creature, and what’s that going to mean in my primary relationship? What’s going to happen?”

And what I found was that nothing different had to happen. Things go on as normal. And that was what developed in that case.

RR: On to a different relationship, can you please describe in 10 words or less what is your perception of God? (Just kidding about the 10 words.)

JC: My only perception is God. That’s all I perceive.

RR: Does the intensity of that change throughout the day or in different situations?

JC: No, because that’s always a constant. What does change sometimes in intensity is the degree to which qualities of Enlightenment are lived out on the level of the senses, and particularly the level of sight.

I do have times when light seems to be just coming at me from all directions. If I look around the room, I’ll see light reflecting off of different surfaces. It just has more of a gleaming quality, and at the same time more of an enhanced three-dimensionality about it. And that’s just what I would consider to be a bonus of the state that I’m in. It’s not a quality, again, to seek to cultivate. But it’s just a side benefit, or a sideshow, if anything.

RR: Or a ripening maybe?

JC: Yeah, but I noticed it immediately when I crossed this line.

RR: If I might add a question that was not asked at the blog, you know I’ve been your friend and I’ve been reading your aura off and on for years [i.e., doing skilled empath merges, aura reading techniques, various forms of energetic literacy].

When I compared your latest set of photos taken in conjunction with “Answers From Silence” to the older photos that were at the Jeffrey Chappell website, it seemed to me that I noticed a greater sweetness and a kind of intensity of the presence of the Divine in that state of Enlightenment in you. Any comment there, dude?

JC: My sense of it is that if that is happening, then it’s happening pretty much without my noticing it.

I feel that I’m in this changeless place and that nothing has changed all this time. So, if I’m evolving, it’s definitely happening by itself.

RR: Happening by itself, but what you described about your senses shifting a little bit, and slightly shifting or ripening experiences of light is something that has been going on…

JC: …ever since.

RR: Ever since. So there hasn’t been any real shift in that, it’s just random?

JC: It is, kind of, and it’s a nice little reminder sometimes, but that’s all it is.

God!

(Jody’s Comment #20)

RR: Got it. Now, if you were brought up within a particular religion, does that theology remain in a kind of a separate compartment of understanding of “Who God is” as a description, or does being Enlightened just make it all clear and very personal now?

JC: It makes it all clear and very personal.

I think it’s worth saying that there are different kinds of understanding.

  • Intellectual understanding is one kind of those kinds of understanding. So to have a theological construct or an idea of who God is would be something that is happening on the level of the intellect.
  • Whereas, when we’re talking about Enlightenment, we’re talking about something that happens in a more all-encompassing way. It’s not just limited to the intellect. The other kind of understanding is direct experience.

RR: I wondered when you were going to drop that other shoe.

JC: Right. So, when you directly experience something, then you also have that sort of understanding of something. And that is the division that is inherent in that question that was asked.

A theological idea would be an intellectual knowledge, and then the living it on a day-to-day, moment-to-moment basis is the experience aspect of the knowledge.

RR: Well, what about other people’s theologies? For example, if someone goes on and on in a very impassioned way about God exclusively belonging to people with a particular understanding, do you find that adorable, flattering, insightful, ridiculous, or what?

JC: I think that there can be a lot of dimensions tied up in that. One is that people can talk about God and be very emotional about it, and what they’re really talking about is their emotions.

Or they can talk about God as if they owned the only right idea about God, and in that case they are talking about being an authority about something or being infallible. They’re not really talking about God. They’re talking about their issue around God.

RR: So is it charming, adorable? When they do these various things –“they” meaning sometimes us — does it just depend on the box people are putting God in, or is it always cute?

JC: Well, no, it’s not cute, for example, in politics, being used as a weapon against other people. That’s not cute.

You know, it would be nice if, instead of boxing God in, people would let God come to them and really allow an experience of grace to enter their hearts.

Remembering the weird old days

(Jordan’s Comment 29)

Now that you’re Enlightened, what is your perception of your life pre-Enlightenment? How do you feel about all that karma?

JC: I have no feeling about it whatsoever. And usually if I think about that pre-Enlightenment life, I think, “Gee, Jeff was a really nice guy.”

RR: I’ll vouch for that.

JC: And that’s about it. You know, the karma thing is so totally burned off that there is really nothing to react to any more.

RR: You know, a lot of people in pursuit of Enlightenment talk a great deal about the alleged importance of finding your purpose. How do you respond to that idea of purpose as a supercharged or evolutionary or important piece of life?

JC: I think that’s a great question.

RR: Thank you. That wasn’t from the blog, exactly (though influenced by Sunny’s Comment 26) but you just made me ask it.

JC: At a certain place — this will sound probably strange, but — the ideal, the goal, is to have no purpose.

So finding a purpose is an intermediary step. It’s leading you on your path of enlightenment.

But the end of the path is that simple aspect of Being. And Being in timelessness, and Being as the potential of all things that take shape, and Being as the true nature of what is.

It’s very hard to say that Being has a purpose.

Also, in timelessness, all moments are totally full and complete. There’s a sense of fullness, a sense of completion.

The only time you have a purpose is when there is something lacking, and the purpose is to fill the lack. So if there’s no lack, then you don’t need a purpose.

These are statements being made from a perspective of timelessness. And I don’t even mean “perspective,” because that implies a choice in adopting a viewpoint of some sort. And I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about knowledge in the sense of direct experience.

So, what I want to do is to speak of what that is as clearly and as straightforwardly as I can and just get that out there so people know about it.

Becoming Enlightened

(Comment 9 from Jim Curry)

Let’s go into some questions about the process of becoming Enlightened. Could someone become Enlightened without ever noticing it?

JC: I doubt it. Although I imagine there might a possibility that it could happen to someone who has absolutely no intellectual framework to interpret the experience.

They might be Enlightened and not be able to say that’s what that is. And that would be fine! It might be better to have the intellectual framework to say that’s what that is, to be able to have a name for the experience.

RR: Do you know any reasonably public figures who might be enlightened and not notice it and not have that intellectual understanding?

JC: No, I don’t. That’s not to say they’re not out there. I think it’s a gift of yours, for example, to be able to do that. And again this comes back to this question of, “Well, you’re Enlightened and therefore I would expect that you have this or that skill or ability.”

Skills and abilities and gifts that people have are the ones that they have. For example, I am a wonderful musician, and that’s a gift that I have. I don’t have the gift of looking at public figures and knowing who’s Enlightened and who’s not, and who does or doesn’t know that they’re Enlightened. That’s a gift that someone else has, for example, Rose.

RR: Well, I don’t know who knows if they’re Enlightened, but that literacy thing, yeah.

JC: Well, Enlightenment doesn’t give you talents that were lacking before, necessarily, or tune you in to certain things in different ways. It’s not about that so much. It’s primarily about a change of identity.

Cosmic calisthenics

(Comment 9 from Jim Curry)

Once that identity has changed, is there a set of exercises or daily practice or routine that’s required in order to stay at that level, sort of like maintenance exercises?

JC: I honesty don’t know the answer to that, because I still do my meditation twice a day that I’ve done ever since 1974, and so it’s possible that that has something to do with maintaining it.

However, I don’t have the sense that it does whatsoever. I mostly do that still out of gratitude, and it’s more of a way of resting the physical body than doing anything else. That’s the benefit I get from it.

But the question is backwards in a way.

It’s not that Enlightenment needs to be maintained, it’s that Enlightenment maintains everything. The source of all existence is maintaining existence. It’s not that you have to do something to maintain the Source. It’s already there.

Influential friends, contagiousness

(Jim Curry’s Comment 10 Also Suzanne’s Comment 21)

Could you improve your chances for becoming spiritually Enlightened by socializing with Enlightened people much in the way that people might join a tennis club or play bridge or that sort of thing?

JC: I think that the answer to that would be yes. I think it could only help to hang out with people like that, to have friends and associates who are putting out good spiritual vibrations.

RR: However, what about the idea of hanging out with people and that [alone] making somebody Enlightened?

JC: You know, I had a student whom I worked with quite a bit. His name is Gideon. He’s mentioned in Answers from Silence. I met with him many times. And each time, I brought another way that I had thought up to advance his consciousness.

I think that there must be a way to do anything; all you have to do is think of how to do it.

I am absolutely not in favor of being bound by traditional ways of doing things. So, if there’s a way to bring somebody along with me, then I would love to find that. In fact, when I sit in silence with someone, I’ve gotten reports from numerous people that they feel an energy coming to them. So I think that something can go on there.

Enlightened or simply goofy with happiness?

(Comment 10 from Jim Curry)

How can you prove to yourself that you are enlightened and not simply in a very good mood? What’s different?

JC: Moods change. Enlightenment doesn’t change. Changelessness does not change. You can be in a good mood, but if you want to prove that you’re enlightened, it’s when you’re still Enlightened when you’re NOT in a good mood.

Enlightenment, grrrrrrrrrr

RR: And speaking of not a good mood, here’s a small assortment of, I think, very eloquent paragraphs that speak to a certain discontent. (Courtesy of Jim Curry’s Comment 24.)

“I am certainly not the only person in the world who has a poor or perhaps distorted notion of what the New Testament says. Listen to or read any evangelical sermon in the country, and you will see clearly that even most (not all) of those who scream harshly, ‘The Bible and only the Bible,’ have no clear idea what the New Testament says.

“Clueless. Totally clueless. If you ask me to be kind—that IS the kind phrasing. Clueless.

“Surveying the literature, I find that mystics and high order spiritual people write in two veins. Some write endlessly and rhapsodically about how good God is. Others say at length what a good deal it is to be Enlightened. Both of these are probably true. Neither is at all useful (to me).

“Why is it that enlightened people tend not to write practically and usefully about the road to Enlightenment?

“Is it the case, then, that people with excellent verbal skills and an ability to communicate well are somehow never the persons who obtain enlightenment? Are verbal/communication skills somehow an impediment?

“Phrased more cynically: Why can’t an all-knowing God pick a prophet who can actually write decently?”

J.C. Yes, Jim, I enjoyed all of your questions tremendously, and I get from them the sense of someone who is a very powerful seeker who is hitting different kinds of frustration with the Enlightenment question.

I think that there are some writers who have written very clearly about it. And in particular, addressing the Christian aspect, I refer you to Alan Watts, and the name of his book is called, “Behold The Spirit”. This is a discussion of Christianity from an enlightened viewpoint, and it is very clear, at least to me when I am reading it.

I also think that Eckhart Tolle’s book, “The Power of Now”, is very clear.

And also Thomas Merton, another Christian figure, wrote, “New Seeds of Contemplation.”

So go read those, and then tell me if it’s not clear, and I’ll see what else I can do about it. But it is not the case that Enlightenment interferes with verbal communication or writing skills. I just think you haven’t hit the right books yet.

RR: And one of those books might, of course, be yours, “Answers From Silence”. And the best way to get that would be what?

JC: [Purchase Answers from Silence] at Amazon.com, and you can also go to answersfromsilence.com, which is the website dedicated to the book, where I have also been putting some articles–at least on a monthly basis if not more frequently–dealing with some of the things that have been coming up in these questions, in fact. So, of course, I highly recommend those.

RR: Is there anything else, Mr. Enlightenment, you would like to say in conclusion for this conversation?

JC: I found that the question [asked by you Blog-Buddies] went into certain categories.

  • Curiosity was one of them: “What’s it like for you?” Kind of implying “What’s it going to be like for me?” [Note from Rose Rosetree: Because Enlightenment comes from internal validation rather than external validation, I didn’t emphasize these well meant questions during the interview.]
  • There were also questions about “Why am I being excluded from Enlightenment? Why is it being withheld from me as being a secret?” and so forth.
  • There were also questions for guidance, and the questions that had to do with kind of assumptions about what it is like to be Enlightened.

For those who were curious, I hope that we answered some of those here.

For the frustrated, I would say: Know that you are blessed, and don’t blame yourself for any seeming lack of progress.

And for those seeking guidance, I would say: You have a part of you that already knows the answers to your questions, and so you should ask that part of yourself for the answers that you need.

RR: Thank you so much, Mr. Enlightenment.

JC: My pleasure!

29 thoughts on “Answers from Mr. Enlightenment”

  • 1
    Heather Crawford says:

    “You know, it would be nice if, instead of boxing God in, people would let God come to them and really allow an experience of grace to enter their hearts”

    WOW. This is VERY powerful for me.

    Thank you so much, Jeffery. And thank you so much, Rose, for facilitating this wonderful, wonderful experience!!!!

    I bought ‘Answers from Silence’ last week and have been unable to put this book down!! VERY POWERFUL.

    My heart is singing 🙂

  • 2
    Jody says:

    Thank you Jeffrey and Rose! And thank you to everyone who asked questions for the Contest; how do the answers come through without the questions, right?

    There is a lot of great new consciousness for me to mull over in the Jeffrey-Rose conversation.

    Rose, also I was wondering if you know if Jeffrey feels loneliness when he is with people who are closed (for example stuck in victim mode and not interested to step out of that, or seeing inhumane things).

    Do Enlightened people still get those existential feelings? Or is that a STUFF thing.

    And how about being an Enlightened HSP or Empath? Would the nervous system then be more resilient, so the world would be not such a sensory overload kind of place to live in?

    No worries if you need to the let the questions fly, I’m sure they will come in for landing some time for me. 🙂

    Thanks again for this blog post, it is great!

  • 3
    Alexey says:

    I really enjoyed listening to the interview. It was a very nice experience to get those glimpses of Enlightenment by listening to Jeffrey’s voice.

    My state absolutely changed (in a good way) when I was listening. Thank you Rose and Jeffrey!

    What makes me wonder is how would another Enlightened person answer the same questions? It might be helpful for those of us who are not Enlightened to listen to different Enlightened people.

    Rose, any plans for another interview? How about George Clooney? 🙂

  • 4
    Suzanne says:

    Thanks Rose and Jeffrey, this was very interesting.

    I am looking forward to reading Answers From Silence, as well as the other books you’ve mentioned.

    And thanks for mentioning your other website, Answers From Silence: http://www.answersfromsilence.com

    I hadn’t seen that before. Beautiful design! I am looking forward to reading the articles.

  • 5
    Anita says:

    Thank you, Rose, for posting this very enlightening interview. And thank you, Jeffrey, for participating.

    I enjoyed the whole interview and especially enjoyed the audio recording. The exchange gave me so much to contemplate, but mostly I felt more at peace with myself and my place in the world at the close of the interview.

  • 6
    Renee says:

    Thank you so much for this interview, it was in itself enlightening.

  • 7
    primrose says:

    Thank you, both of you. I really enjoyed reading that.

    I love the answers. I don’t yet understand the idea of a change in identity, but maybe one day I will.

    And I really like that trauma fell away for you, Jeffrey. Sounds a much cheaper option than doing years of therapy!

  • 8
    Lara says:

    Thank you so much Rose and Jeffrey. This was wonderful, and much more than just intellectualy interesting; it somehow affected me on many levels.

    And thank you also for mentioning the website. I can’t wait to read the articles and Jeffrey’s book.

  • 9
    Elaine Warfield says:

    Wonderful interview. Thanks, Rose and Jeffrey.

    I read “Answers from Silence” many months ago when Rose mentioned the title to me.

  • 10
    Jim Curry says:

    When I was a teaching assistant in grad school, a very troubled student approached me with a question that worried him quite deeply.

    I was teaching math, and his was a theology question. So, I asked his critical question to the Chairman of the Theology Department, a Cambridge-educated theologian. He said, “Well, it’s not really a question, is it?”

    Being the sort of person I am, I said, “Damn right it’s a question—you can tell it’s a question, because I just asked it.”

    Of course, he missed the point that the student was in practical trouble, and I missed the point (predictably) that the professor was answering in a “learned and witty” Cambridge vein.

    I always expect Enlightened people to answer in useless and pedantic ways–as the theologian was trying to do. You didn’t. Thank you.

  • 11

    Dear Everyone:


    I am very happy to see that the interview was so meaningful for you. I especially thank Rose for making it possible and for having the brilliant idea to do it in the first place!

    I am going to post a few more responses here to your follow-up comments, so scroll down to look for those.

    I am also planning to write a blog article that deals with some of the other questions that weren’t answered in the original interview and then post it on my website. I’ll let you know when that has happened, and provide a URL to that article in a comment here.

  • 12

    Jody, regarding your questions in Comment #2 above, I’ll provide a quote from the last chapter of my book, Answers From Silence:

    “I used to ‘sense out’ people when I looked at them. Each person had a different mood and vibe. I was reading their life agenda and checking out the games they were playing. Now everybody looks and feels the same to me — wonderful.”

  • 13

    Dear Suzanne:

    Regarding your admiration of my website http://www.answersfromsilence.com, in Comment #4 above, this is just to say that the site is now undergoing an update and will be even more beautiful in the near future. I hope you’ll visit it again later on for more enjoyment.

  • 14

    Dear Primrose:

    I’d like to help you to understand the idea of a change of identity. The question here is, a change from what to what?

    Most people identify with the circumstances of their life story, including their habits and favorites.

    Enlightenment is the change from that to identifying oneself as pure conciousness. The self is not defined by circumstances but instead by its own essential nature, which is changeless and eternal.

    So that is the idea. Which is to say, the intellectual sort of understanding. Now you just need the experiential kind of understanding as well! But I am fairly sure that most people have experienced a taste of that from time to time. Otherwise, they wouldn’t seek more of it.

  • 15
    Primrose says:

    Thank you, Jeffrey!

    I have had moments of that. After doing birth primals (Primal Therapy) I have had moments of complete peace and bliss. Everything falls away and I am one.

    I had one experience where I was in the womb and everything was perfect. I didn’t feel that I was breathing, or needed to, and it seemed timeless.

    I have also experienced that doing a technique called Core Transformation. The one-ness is perfection.

    I haven’t stayed in that though, it’s just broken through, or I have broken through somehow. So my sense is that it is always there, that joy is always there at the core of me, existing in perfection under all my day to day pain, and I just have a lot of pain in the way of accessing it.

  • 16
    Jody says:

    Jeffrey thank you for your answer and quote. When I saw it, it was like *omg* pure awesomeness typed my name!

    Like if Bono gave a shout out to me at a concert! Then I remembered Rose’s “Talking to Mr. Enlightenment” blog post and realised I was being sooooo Stage 1. 🙂

    But still, Enlightened peeps are superstars to me.

    I am pretty sure I have some funny ideas of what being in the state of Enlightenment means (funny ideas for example what is in my ‘God box’).

    Answers From Silence is on my reading list, so I hope to develop a better understanding and clear out some cobwebs.

  • 17
    Jeffrey says:

    Dear Primrose:

    Regarding your comment #15, I’m glad that you sense an underlying perfection that is always there. The question then for you is how not to have any pain in the way of accessing it. I take it that you mean emotional pain.

    Rose asked me whether my “vanished birth trauma” was a “falling away with insight, or falling away like a dog shaking water off.” Let’s try both of these angles.

    One possible insight about a feeling of pain is that it is actually a feeling of love. It is love that is blocked in its flow. That feels painful.

    One possible way to shake pain like a dog shaking water off is to say that the pain is just part of the scenery. In that way, you don’t take ownership of the pain. Then the pain is feeling the pain, instead of you feeling the pain.

    I’m just putting these out there in case either has any value for you.

  • 18
    primrose says:

    Thank you, Jeffrey!

    What I’ve experienced about pain is very like what you describe. I’ve felt pain and realised that it is not me, that it isn’t even something that I need to stay in, but can pass through to joy, but even though I’ve experienced that, and understand it, I don’t hold onto that understanding.

    I am still attached to pain I think. It is good to write about it because it reminds me that I can apply that understanding whenever I’m in pain.

    I really appreciate you responding. Thank you.

  • 19
    Jordan says:

    Thank you Rose and Jeffrey!! I loved reading and listening to this interview, and I’m so happy you asked two of my questions!!

    Lots of thanks, Rose, for all your follow-up questions to the sex question! You definitely helped get more at the core of what I was asking.

    Jeffrey, when you talk about thinking of pre-Enlightenment Jeffrey as a nice guy, it sounds a lot like how someone might relate to a past life identity. Is that how it feels to you? (If you have experience with that).

    I really loved this line (actually I found it hilarious):
    “…people can talk about God and be very emotional about it, and what they’re really talking about is their emotions.”

    That is SOOOO OBVIOUS, sometimes!!

  • 20

    PRIMROSE, at a blog that is devoted to spiritual healing (Energy Spirituality) rather than psychological healing, I would like to draw a tiny distinction. One that I happen to notice because of the way I am positioned as a healer.

    Reminding yourself of principles of spiritual truth falls squarely under the category of psychological healing. This is different from the spontaneous experiences of an Enlightened person.

    An alternative is to use Energy Spirituality techniques, such as cutting a cord of attachment, in order to move out a long-term cause of pain.

    It will be interesting, when and if you decide to experience this second type of healing, for you to notice (or even describe) how big a difference this is.

    Meanwhile, perhaps some of you Blog-Buddies might have a comment about the difference you have found between reminding yourself of an inspiring idea versus having greater wholeness in your mind-body-spirit functioning.

  • 21
    primrose says:

    Thanks Rose. I really look forward to experiencing cord cutting (done properly!) and will be happy to describe any difference I find in that process compared to the psychological work I’ve done. I wonder though if there will be a great difference?

    I’ve never simply done “talk-therapy”; the work I’ve done had always been about integrating what happens in my body and mind.

    The more I open to the ideas of energy work, the more I wonder if I have not been doing it for many years under the guise of psychotherapy!

  • 22
    primrose says:

    Ah Rose, I just re-read your post and understood what you meant more fully.

    My experience of moving out pain is just that, pain is removed.

    When I wrote that I am still attached to pain; I mean that I still have pain to process, other pain.

    I have worked through and released a lot of emotional blocks in my life. Of course there may be better more efficient ways of releasing pain (which is why in here to find out) but I’m not interested in trying to “think” my way through an issue by being inspired by an idea.

    I’m only interested in processes that work and help me become more balanced, whether they come under the banner of psychotherapy or spiritual healing, I don’t really mind.

  • 23

    PRIMMIE, thanks so much for your latest two comments. The short answer for now is simply this: No, regardless of how talented and persistent you are at doing psychological healing, it does not create spiritual healing (as I define it, anyway). Period.

    And spiritual healing, as in Energy Spirituality, does not do the job of psychological healing. They are different models. They address different levels.

    This is why referrals can be done both ways between mental health practitioners, like psychotherapists and psychiatrists, and a professional at Energy Spirituality.

    You really are speaking for a lot of lurkers here, I’m sure, by doing what you can to tease out the differences between these two types of healing. PRIMMIE, you’re getting me all geared up to devoting a post soon to the topic. What are the differences between Spiritual Healing and Psychological Healing?

    Just keep checking in regularly! It’s coming soon, for sure.

  • 24
    primrose says:

    I really look forward to reading that! I’m planning on exploring cord cutting the way you do it in the New Year. Am excited about it.

  • 25
    Grace says:

    My experience has been that there’s definitely a difference between psychological healing and Energy Spirituality. Of course, in my own case, I doubt that I would have made my way to Energy Spirituality without having done therapy first. There is great value in psychological healing and I tend to see it as part of a spectrum of healing.

    I also think that it’s quite difficult to grasp this distinction between the two types of healing without having the experience of Energy Spirituality.

    I’m very sensitive and my experience with cord cutting, whether the ones Rose did initially or the many I’ve done since, is that I feel some kind of effect immediately. When one of the major cords was cut, I felt as if I’d lost 50 pounds instantaneously.

  • 26
    Bobby says:

    Primrose, I offer a little guidance, if you are willing to accept that is… Anyone can know how to read a poem, but there are a select few who can Understand it. In a quest for wisdom, understanding will be your most valuable tool. As with everything, especially written works, there is a different interpretation for every alternate perspective on one specific situation. So for every second of the day, there are over a trillion different outcomes that could occur. This is where understanding comes into play, If you understand the “Why’s” and “How’s” of life, then there is no boulder that could stand in your way, any question in any situation can be solved in a blink of an eye, as long as you understand the “why’s” and “how’s”. But how do you come to this level of understanding? That’s what everyone wants to know, and it’s a simple answer. Sit in front of a mirror for an extended time, and ask yourself. “Who Am I?” By answering the “Who”; the “Why” and “How” will come into focus, and you can see then, How connected we all really are..

  • 27
    Jeffrey says:

    Dear Jordan:

    Regarding your comment #19 (“when you talk about thinking of pre-Enlightenment Jeffrey as a nice guy, it sounds a lot like how someone might relate to a past life identity. Is that how it feels to you?”), the quick, simple answer is yes.

    There’s a little more to it, though. Since my temporal experience is timelessness, the past seems like one big pool instead of a single line disappearing into the distance along a chain of cause and effect.

    Finally, here is a quote from Answers From Silence: “There is one life and there is one illusion, and that illusion is that there are many lives.”

  • 28
    Andrea says:

    I’m very new to Rose’s blog. But I found this comment thread and could not help but add what I hope will be my contribution to the body of knowledge contained here.

    This post began as a direct response to Mr. Chappell but as I went on I found more comments and ideas I wanted to address from different people. So it turned into a kind of hodge podge. Please forgive me if I have offended anyone with this approach.

    For the record, I do not consider myself to be particularly Enlightened — oops, I guess that’s like being a little bit pregnant. So I do not consider myself Enlightened.

    However I have had direct experiential contact with That Which Binds All Things Together, The Love and Light that both surrounds and pulsates through every molecule of The Universe. And… it’s good stuff! And it has continuity.

    It was not some bliss-filled visionary episode after three days of fasting and meditation. This, as Mr. Chappell so astutely differentiates, is not the same thing as an intellectual understanding.

    It’s not the same as going to church, mosque, synagogue or circle and getting all emotional about the concept. It’s as different as reading the manual when you’re learning to drive a car and actually driving the car. If that distinction helps anyone, then I have been of service and I am grateful and feel both honored and blessed.

    Regarding comment #12, about “sensing out” people, that is what I used to do as well, in fact still catch myself doing sometimes when I’m not careful. I think that comes partially from being an empath. But I think it also comes from being able to see the “God” (insert whatever term you choose there) in everybody.

    There is a spark of the Divine in each of us. In point of fact, we are all PART of the Divine. There is no separation. And yes, it is also correct. There are no games to play, no masks to wear. We all shine the Light of Perfect Love brilliantly, each and every one of us.

    I like to say each one of us is a single facet in the Infinite jewel which is… whatever you want to call It. That’s overly simplistic I admit. But the most profound experiences need not be complex.

    I also resonate with Mr. Chappell’s remarks about not having to “do” anything. I don’t like to quote from a particular religion but there is a passage in the Bible about the lilies of the field. They spin not, neither do they toil. Hey, they’re just lilies. They’re really good at being lilies and that’s all they have to be.

    This attempts to speak to Bobby’s comment to Primrose about “Who am I?” You are not your job, any of your roles, your religious upbringing or lack thereof, your bank account balance, your nationality, your sexual preference, your political affiliation, your social status, your fame or obscurity … I think you get the picture.

    Considering Mr. Chappell’s words on a change of identity, that has been called in some traditions the dissolution of ego, surrendering to absolute consciousness, universal consciousness, Samadhi, Nirvana, desirelessness or freedom from attachment.

    What’s tricky here for us mortals is we still have to walk around, fix dinner, put gas in the car, get colds, pay the mortgage, eat dinner with in-laws — all those pesky little mundane things that are required here at, as Rose refers to it, Earth School. I for one have never wanted to go sit on a rock and chant all day and we all benefit from Mr. Chappell’s choice not to do so either.

    The way it seems to me is that we are dancing a duet here on the third dimensional plane. We have our God-self and our Ego-self. The two can be present at the same time, however. And I’m coming to see through learning from Rose that they must both be present at the same time if we are to do what we chose to come here to do.

    Let’s face it. It’s a pretty courageous choice to incarnate to this 3-D plane. It’s ugly sometimes, or at least there is a perception of lack of that Perfect Beauty, there is the appearance of pain, plus compared to the Etheric Plane, it’s incredibly dense and S-L-O-W moving.

    Yes, we have to deal with the illusion of time here, too. But we made that choice as souls to come here. And each of us will be leaving something of our Ego-selves behind when we “die.”

    So what we truly are is Eternal. It has always existed. It is formlessness. It cannot die. But, while we are here, it seems the most prudent use of our stay to use our 3-D gifts to the fullest extent possible. To do otherwise would be an incredible waste of an incredible opportunity and experience.

    I’m going to shut up now because, as usual, this one has gone on far longer than I intended. Once I get wound up, it’s pretty hard to stop me.

    But I am low man on the totem pole here and as such am demonstrating respect and courtesy for the more longstanding members of the community by exercising restraint. If, and only if others find my comments informative, useful or otherwise helpful in some way, then I may open up more freely when I feel I’ve been given tacit “permission” to do so. It’s not my way to step on the toes of others and I am always respectful.

    Thank you for the opportunity to express my views here. And thank you for taking the time to read through them if you do.

  • 29
    Heather Crawford says:

    Hello again Mr. Chappell!

    Concerning your comment #27 back to Jordan, your last sentence really resonated with me. Truly beautiful. Thank you for that.

    “Finally, here is a quote from Answers From Silence: “There is one life and there is one illusion, and that illusion is that there are many lives.” ”

    Andrea, thank you for sharing your thoughts! You write beautifully and welcome to the community 🙂

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