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Moving into Enlightenment, My Story. A guest post by SANDRA HAERING

Sandra in Enlightenment, ready for anyone's aura reading

Sandra in Enlightenment, ready for anyone’s aura reading

One more Enlightenment saga awaits you, Blog-Buddies, to read if you’re curious. Please don’t read SANDRA’s tale in order to worship her.

She doesn’t need that.

Nor to follow her example.

You are your own glorious example, you householder, on your unique and Divinely cherished path of personal development. Maybe you might like to call that “Human-Based Spirituality.” Because it is.

Pursuing Householder Enlightenment goes faster if you live as a householder, not a renunciate wannabe. And if you pay attention to human-type experience, rather than seeking The Romance of the Astral or the flashier forms of Divine blessing. These aren’t required at all.

You may not even experience drama when you move into Enlightenment. That is when it can be helpful to have an Enlightenment Coach, helping you to sort things out.

In the Guest Post that follows, I have added headings, links, minor edits as usual. What else is left to disclose? That SANDRA person has crossed the threshold. Hesitatingly or not, by now she is Enlightened.

Enlightenment Can Begin without a Flashy Start

I had read every word written by our fellow Blog Buddies who crossed into the Enlightened state, and also read Jeffrey Chappell’s book, “Answers from Silence,” several times. I found them fascinating and helpful, and that’s why I want to share my experience with you now.

Even after reading all of that, I still didn’t know when I “became” Enlightened. More about that later.

In retrospect, an initial crossover into Enlightenment might have happened in early September.

At the time I had just completed a personal mentoring session with Rose via Skype to take the Cut Cords of Attachment Workshop Level II. (By the way, I would highly recommend treating yourself to these kind of sessions with Rose. It is totally tailored to you, and you get Rose’s undivided attention!)

For practice after the mentoring session, I cut a cord of attachment that, on paper, looked like a minor cord of attachment.

It was not minor. After cutting it I experienced emotional releasing. I went into deep grief.

I knew this feeling would be temporary, but after a couple of days, I said “Enough is enough! No need to ask me if I want to be Enlightened, the answer is YES!”

As if being Enlightened means no more grief.

Vigorously Pursuing STUFF Removal, then PUT IN with What Thrills My Soul

Next I decided to take action to move out what stood between me and Enlightenment.

I made a list of the most intense Cords of Attachment remaining, and decided to make appointments with Rose for phone sessions of Aura Transformation. The plan was to have these sessions closer together than my prior sessions, and to get this show on the road!

After making that decision, I started to feel better right away.

For the next few days I spontaneously lived in the moment, savoring each and every moment. It was bliss. I wondered: “Am I Enlightened?”

After a few days, the bliss eased up a bit. Still happy most of the time, but just not as intensely so.

Could I Be Enlightened and Not Feel Perfect?

Thoughts of self-condemnation (an old pattern for me) began to arise. I didn’t believe it was possible to be Enlightened and hate myself at the same time, so I decided I was not enlightened.

My session with Rose came soon after that. She told me, after the Skilled Empath Merge at the start of our session,  she thought that I was either Enlightened or very close to it.

I told her that I was not, in my opinion, Enlightened; though I had just gone through an experience that was close.

Anyway, during the session Rose facilitated cutting a very major Cord of Attachment, and afterwards invited me to send in a picture of myself after the healing had integrated. I did send her a self-portrait a few days later, and Rose very kindly responded that, in her opinion, I was not yet Enlightened.

The following months were back-and-forth. I found myself enjoying even the most mundane tasks. I had some closets to organize, but had previously been too overwhelmed by them to even begin.

I not only found it easy to tackle them, but had a blast, and then kept going! My whole house is organized now. It just made me so happy.

During the clean-up, I threw out almost thirty years of journals. They just were not important to me anymore.

Releasing Last STUFF Before Enlightenment

These times of great happiness were interspersed with self-flagellation. I eventually would cease the self-recrimination, but sometimes it would take a week of misery first.

The misery was getting less and less, and the joy was getting to be more and more. My experience with people and the rest of life was with a sense of the “bigger picture.”

Then I decided to call Rose to have a session to deal with the remaining vestiges of self-hate. I thought it was just STUFF. And according to Rose, all STUFF can be healed.

Well, according to Rose, it was not STUFF, but bugs in my subconscious programming. Vibrational Re-Positioning, was the technique she chose for our healing centerpiece in the session of aura healing. For homework, Rose armed me with a “Recipe” to follow every time I felt badly.

One of the biggest benefits from this session was that when the feeling arose afterwards, I knew it was not me. It was subconscious-level code or a pattern that just seemed to have a life of its own after years of regular expression. Then I followed the recipe, and had immediate relief!

Apparently a person can have code like this and be enlightened at the same time!

What Else Helps Me Flow in Enlightenment

There are other action items that keep this old, stuck pattern from repeating:

1) Using my skills as an empath,

2) Nurturing Soul Thrill, or doing something that I love to do every day,

3) And practicing no more than 20 minutes of Technique Time per day.

I am so happy to be an Apprentice in the Mentoring Program for Rosetree Energy Spirituality. Rose, her Enlightenment coaching, and the rest of her body of work, have helped me move quickly along the path to Enlightenment. I hope to do the same for others some day.

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  1. 1

    Thanks for all the sweet things you said about my work and your giving a shout-out to the magnificent book, “Answers from Silence,” by Jeffrey Chappell.

    Especially thank you for sharing something so personal and honest and very human, SANDRA.

  2. 2
    David.. says:

    Thanks for sharing, Sandra. Sounds pretty classic to me. Sometimes people do have big flashy shifts, but for many it’s a much more gentle and gradual change that gets clear over time.

    I know a fellow who wasn’t certain for 5 years after his shift – but that’s an extreme.

    It’s kind a like becoming a teenager. We might mark a certain birthday as the threshold but when we actually shifted is more of a process. Sometimes more before the birthday, sometimes later on.

  3. 3
    Isabella says:

    Thank you Sandra! What a very lovely story.

  4. 4
    Julie says:

    That’s wonderful, Sandra. Congratulations! I enjoyed reading this and found the Vibrational Re-Positioning especially interesting.

  5. 5
    Renee says:

    Congratulations! Sandra!! So interesting how you struggled still with such painful emotions. Thank you so much for sharing your experience, it is so exciting, fun, interesting and encouraging to be let in on your unique way of coming into enlightenment.

  6. 6
    Linda Stone says:

    Thank you Sandra, Your story is inspirational and hopeful….. and congratulations.

  7. 7
    Jean says:

    Hey Sandra – thanks for sharing. Congratulations.

    Helps me gain a greater understanding of pre enlightenment – then on to enlightenment – and beyond.

    Especially beautiful to hear how you and Rose worked together on this.

    Inspiring 🙂

  8. 8
    Rachel says:

    Yes, really good to read your story Sandra. Thanks for sharing.

  9. 9
    Dana says:

    Thank you for sharing, Sandra. I liked hearing about your process into Enlightenment.

  10. 10
    Primmie says:

    Congratulations, I love your story. It is very inspiring.

  11. 11
    Sandra says:

    Thank you, everyone, for your kind words.

    David, so interesting to hear that this is the typical experience in the beginning stages of enlightenment! Adam’s post last week is additional confirmation of that.

  12. 12
    Lara says:

    Thank you for writing this Sandra it was lovely to read, and congratulations too. I also found removing cords of attachment the big catalyst (thank you Rose!!)

  13. 13
    Jill Erin says:

    Sandra, what a lovely sharing. Congratulations! I had the same experience as you of a gradual awareness that I had made a permanent shift, but couldn’t tell you exactly when that happened. And, like you, the Cutting of Cords of Attachment and other sessions with Rose were very important in assisting that shift and making it happen a lot faster.

  14. 14
    Elaine says:

    Wonderful. Congratulations Sandra.

  15. 15
    Kira says:

    Very interesting to read! I guess I had sort of an inverse experience, in that I had something flashy that wasn’t Enlightenment, but I relate to the changes in mood.

    I also feel less self-conscious about not having known one way or the other.

  16. 16
    David.. says:

    Seems to me it’s worth noting here that there is different steps in this. The first is what some have called soul awakening, when we become aware that we are not this person but rather are spiritual at core. This can happen slowly or suddenly and millions of people have had this shift.

  17. 17
    David.. says:

    The next step is when we shift from the recognition to the being; we are spirit having a human experience. This is the true spiritual awakening, what Rose has called Awakened Consciousness, also called Self Realization or Cosmic Consciousness. This is not just a recognition or understanding but a shift in being. It is the true “born again” or second birth.

    It too can be quiet or very distinct. It can be accompanied or overshadowed by a big release or flashy stuff or not but there is usually some sort of release. It is a shift from being ego-based to cosmic-based but this difference may or may not be clear initially as it can be subtle and is new. First time in all our lifetimes.

    It is the key for what what follows.

  18. 18
    David.. says:

    The next step is when the above becomes integrated and the Stuff, as Rose calls it, is cleared. Then the energy physiology can come into balance and the divine begin to flow through us. This is Enlightenment.

    Fully developed, this stage is called Sat Chit Ananda (absolute bliss consciousness) or Nirvana.

  19. 19
    David.. says:

    Most remarkably, this is the steps of the first of 6 stages of this. But they are the most important steps. Without that shift in being and the clearing of mud, the platform isn’t there to support what follows.

    And with Rosetree Energy Spiritually, there is that clear development of the refinement process. Rose liked my term over on the Enlightenment Life list – Skilled Enlightenment. 😉

    If interested, I go over the stages here:
    http://davidya.ca/2014/01/25/stages-of-development-in-consciousness/

  20. 20
  21. 21
    Primmie says:

    I’m not sure when I found this site, over 5 years ago. I remember reading about Enlightenment and thinking it was something I wasn’t remotely interested in. Now I love reading about it. It makes me very happy because it seems to me to be a call to self and makes such sense and is beautiful. Thank you Rose and everyone for sharing your experiences, I feel privileged to be part of this online community.

  22. 22
    Isabella says:

    That term “Skilled Enlightenment” really caught my eye and excited me as well.

  23. 23
    Isabella says:

    “The first is what some have called soul awakening, when we become aware that we are not this person but rather are spiritual at core. This can happen slowly or suddenly and millions of people have had this shift.”

    Is it possible there’s another very important shift before this (within human life)? I have read people’s auras where it seems to me they are basically on autopilot, without much room for contemplation or any “deciding” about how to behave or react. Just reflexes and impulses, basically.

    I think these people would need to shift into realizing that they even exist before any of the other stages.

  24. 24
    Kylie says:

    Very interesting and helpful Sandra, thanks. It was helpful to know that it wasn’t entirely clear to you when you became enlightened, and that doubts accompanied the process.

  25. 25
    Teresa says:

    David,
    Thank you for your description and explanation of the stages.
    After reading all the posts on enlightment I’m feeling a bit like a blind man during a dissertation on color but I’m sure someday I will “see” what you are describing.
    🙂

  26. 26
    David.. says:

    The point, btw is that awakening is a distinctive shift whereas Enlightenment is more of a process to complete it. As a result, you’re more likely to notice the first at the time and the second in retrospect. But of course ‘experience may vary’. 😉

  27. 27
    David.. says:

    Hi Isabella
    Yes, what I describe is the first in the process of enlightenment. Human development prior to that also has stages. In Loevingers model of ego development, for example, a child goes through 3 stages of “pre-conventional” development. Then the first “Conventional” stage is called Conformist and the second is called Self-aware. ie: they become aware they are, as you observe. That gives a much less B&W perception and thus more awareness of options.

    While full human development has much more potential, a significant percent of the population stall out in Conventional stages.

    After Conventional is Post-conventional. And then Post-Personal, which is how Transpersonal Psychology has come to label enlightenment. They currently recognize 2 stages.

    If interested, Loevingers stages are outlined here:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loevinger%27s_stages_of_ego_development

  28. 28
    David.. says:

    Teresa –
    Yes, the mind cannot grasp what is not yet part of the experience though it will certainly try. But it’s not important that you understand it – only that you recognize it’s there so there’s some context as it unfolds.

    Some teachers refuse to talk about stages, feeling concepts about stages are barriers to living it. This can be true, if we hold the concepts too tightly. But if we don’t offer a map for those who have reached the next port, then we leave them without the wisdom of past travelers.

    Your approach is the right one.

  29. 29
    Isabella says:

    Oh I see, thanks for the reply David.

  30. 30
    Rachel says:

    Sandra, may I ask a practical question? Did you re-read all your journals before throwing them out?

    I have been attempting some de-cluttering since the new year, but I have piles of journals and it is taking me ages to read through them. Somehow I felt I owed them the honour of reading them through before chucking them out.

    And Rose, I wondered if you would have any comment on whether re-reading old journals would count as technique time?

    Thanks to you both!

  31. 31

    RACHEL, re-reading old journals does not count as Technique Time.

    Reading anything does not count as Technique Time unless…

    It is otherworldly material, designed to inspire a love of living in heaven, preparing for death, learning about an alternative reality where you might perhaps ascend or bilocate.

    Even reading science fiction doesn’t count, unless it has a spiritual quality throughout and no plot other than dumping the “stupid” human experiences.

  32. 32

    Writing in your journal might not count as Technique Time, either.

    Is it all a Proustian exploration of the deepest subjective experiences?

    Then yes. Technique Time.

    Is it a Samuel Pepys recount of doing your dance, etc.?

    Decidedly no.

    Describing what you did, what happened, with a few human-level (surfacey, primary-colored) emotions attached?

    Not Technique Time either. Make sense?

  33. 33
    David.. says:

    Hi Rachel
    You may want to reframe the exercise. Sometimes journaling is an exercise in personal clarity. Writing is a way towards that at the time. It doesn’t dishonor it to let it go later.

    I would also consider it a red flag if you have a sense of should or must about this. A resistance to letting go. You may find a simple ceremony of gratitude and release will replace all the reading.

  34. 34
    David.. says:

    For myself, I found that peeling the onion of resistance came off in layers. Over time, I would would sometimes become aware of where this or that holding was stored. That would help release the bigger globs.

    At a certain point, I began to become aware of places in my environment I was storing resistance. This was a surprise, but certain possessions had energetic loads.

    I had stored my old daytimers, for example, with a similar idea. I’d go back over them later and extract the observations I’d made, etc. Only it turns out they were a big lump of dark inertia. Letting them go was a big relief. 😉

  35. 35
    Sandra says:

    Hi Rachel,

    In answer to your question: no, I did not reread them. Though I had read them several times in the past. When I threw them away, I didn’t know I was enlightened. All I knew was that I no longer identified with the spiritual seeker expressed on those pages. I loved all those journals, they meant a lot to me at one time. And I very happily, without ceremony, threw them out!

    Whatever is right for you, Rachel! Who knows, you might have the beginnings of your personal memoirs in there!

  36. 36
    David.. says:

    (laughs) yeah – it was the daytimers I’d carried around that had the load. The journals I’ve never read except for bits and don’t relate to much now either (like another lifetime) but I do occasionally go digging in them to try and understand how something unfolded. Memory is not the greatest there.

    It’s all digitized now, scanned so it doesn’t require a bunch of physical space. Searchable would be good but the earlier stuff was handwritten and no way that scribble would convert. (laughs)

    Buckminster Fuller decided to document his life as an experiment. So there’s different approaches. The key is in letting go of what binds you- be it physical, emotional, or whatever.

  37. 37
    Rachel says:

    Thanks all, for your replies – greatly appreciated.

    And yes Rose, that does make sense. I think I am midway between Proust and Pepys ;).

    Actually so far the journals have veered from being fascinating to downright tedious. Feels good to be letting them go.

  38. 38
    Primmie says:

    I think I may be close to Enlightenment. There I’ve written it. I could be wrong of course. It’s just that the stages make sense of my recent experiences. I feel calm these days and it’s come out of the blue at a time of immense personal sadness. I feel so quiet and calm inside. No bells or whistles or bliss or anything, just a quiet inside and I’m looking out through my eyes and feelings arise and words arise and life goes on as normal, but internally I am still. It’s completely new for me.

  39. 39

    Hi Sandra,

    I loved this, thank you for writing it 🙂

    Isn’t Vibrational Re-Positioning great?

    Initially, it felt strange for me to think of healing techniques for enlightened people.

    But Vibrational Re-Positioning makes a lot of sense in this context.

  40. 40

    With techniques where removal of STUFF is central (like the 12 Steps To Cut Cords Of Attachment) – these don’t appear to be as relevant any more once you have become enlightened, given that being free of STUFF is a core criterion in the RES definition of enlightenment.

    However, our subconscious code is not STUFF. To use a computer metaphor – this code is more like an operating system, where STUFF might be more akin to malware or viruses. You can’t just get rid of it like STUFF – you need an OS so you can function. To my mind, Vibrational Repositioning is like applying the latest patches and updates for your operating system. Debugging, optimising, fixing vulnerabilities.

    Rose, I hope my analysis is mostly correct, and that I haven’t necessitated too much red-pen-wielding 🙂

  41. 41

    ADAM, thank you for this very astute analysis.

    As a technique in the world, Vibrational Re-Positioning(TM) is still new. It’s delightful to see it bringing results to clients, including ones in Enlightenment.

    In sessions of Rosetree Energy Spirituality, I reserve the right to select which technique to use as a Healing Centerpiece.

    (When it is a session for Aura Healing. Sometimes clients choose Aura Reading or Mentoring, with the session to follow accordingly.)

  42. 42

    PRIMMIE, there’s a standing offer with this blog community. If you feel pretty sure that you are in Enlightenment, you’re welcome to email me a recent photo.

    I will research it, much like candidates for the Enlightenment Life List, just a YES or NO.

    Another free service gladly supplied by me at this time, in my capacity as an Enlightenment Coach.

    Only be advised that I will do this ONCE per person per incarnation. Depending on how busy things get around here, I may not always be able to take the time to deliver this help as a free service, but it is available for now.

    My email is rose at rose-Rosetree.com.

  43. 43

    Another possibility if you feel that you are moving towards Enlightenment or may have crossed the threshold?

    You might choose to do a phone session with me, or a Skype one — voice or video, your preference.

    Choose a session of Aura Healing and Transformation. Automatically I check for Enlightenment in any of these sessions. If not, I may be able to make you move forward more rapidly in that direction. If you are Enlightened, I can still help you move toward your very human intention for the session, like “More confidence as a mother” or “Better Time Management.”

  44. 44
    Sandra says:

    Hi Adam,

    Yes, Adam, I think Vibrational Re-Positioning is fantastic, and I love your analogy.

    Not only is it an effective re-coding tool, but it also brings the subconscious code into the conscious mind.

    Another side benefit is the realization that it is not yourself, but just code.

    Rose, I have a new saying for you: It is just CODE, and CODE can always, always be replaced.

  45. 45
    Sandra says:

    Hi Primmie,

    It probably goes without saying that I believe having sessions with Rose is one of the fastest ways to move forward in your personal evolution.

    Best wishes to you!

  46. 46

    SANDRA, thank you for publicly acknowledging Vibrational Re-Positioning, and for your great saying, “It is just CODE, and CODE can always, always be replaced.”

    I’m going to start using this for sure.

    Blog-Buddies, besides being true about subconscious code, SANDRA has made a bit of an in-joke. Because formerly there was just ONE motto in Rosetree Energy Spirituality:

    STUFF can always, always, always be healed.

    Now we have TWO mottoes, thanks to SANDRA.

  47. 47
    Primmie says:

    Rose, I would like to have a session with you about it, not now as I’m moving house, but I would really love that. Thank you for offering to read my aura. I will hold off until I’m sure, I think I’m approaching it but am not yet Enlightened. Well I never thought I’d be having this kind of discussion on the blog, but I am.

    I walked out this morning onto a quiet street and inside I was quiet and the world was quiet. Everything was the same and it was just so lovely. I realised today that the idea of being an atheist is utterly meaningless. I am silence, I am life. There isn’t anything external to believe in or not believe in. Which is quite funny as last Sunday I was saying to people I know in a spiritual community “Well, I’ve been around this community for years now and I’m still an atheist, I doubt that will ever change”. A week later that seems like a lifetime ago.

  48. 48

    Lurking within every atheist, PRIMMIE, is someone who really loves God.

    And, often, that atheist is deeply honest, not willing to settle for a cheap imitation. At least, that’s my hunch.

    How lovely that experience is your teacher, not some guru or scripture but Experience Itself!

    When you move house, incidentally, you can clean up the place from icky old energies by using the techniques in “Use Your Power of Command for Spiritual Cleansing and Protection.” Here’s a link for browsing:

    https://www.rose-rosetree.com/spiritual-cleansing-protection-book.htm

  49. 49
    David.. says:

    Adam –
    great discrimination. It also explains how someone who is enlightened can still stumble sometimes. Free of Stuff but there may some lousy programming.

  50. 50
    David.. says:

    Hi Primmie
    The trick with ideas of atheist, agnostic and theist is that they’re all just concepts. Statements of position or belief.

    Once there is direct experience (gnostic), it renders it all mot.

  51. 51
    Primmie says:

    Thank you Rose, I will follow that link.

    I don’t know if atheists are very honest, but I do think I could never follow something that didn’t feel right, so I would have to wait around for a very clear connection to God. It would have to be a strong thunk on the head sort of experience. Other people talking about a thing, however lovely, hasn’t ever made me feel one drop of belief.

    David, it is very funny to me that I’ve overnight given up the idea of being an atheist and seen that it is simply a concept. How I’ve loved being an atheist. Now it just doesn’t matter. Feeling divine dismantles things with ease.

  52. 52
    Primmie says:

    Sandra, thank you! I am sure you are right.

  53. 53
    Amanda says:

    Primmie, every one of your comments has made my heart sing.

    Thank you.

    Amanda

  54. 54
    Julie says:

    Gorgeous comments, Primmie. I love your description in comment #38.

  55. 55
    Primmie says:

    Amanda thank you! My heart is singing with you.

  56. 56

    ISABELLA, I had time today to review this thread and properly saw you asked me a (great) question in Comment #23.

    Sometimes I get busy, you know! I always want to answer.

    Anyway, you observed, “I have read people’s auras where it seems to me they are basically on autopilot, without much room for contemplation or any “deciding” about how to behave or react. Just reflexes and impulses, basically.

    I think these people would need to shift into realizing that they even exist before any of the other stages.”

  57. 57

    An insightful observation for sure, ISABELLA. And to put this in proper context, Blog-Buddies, ISABELLA isn’t just some casual or judgmental aura reader.

    ISABELLA is close to graduating from the Mentoring Program in Rosetree Energy Spirituality.

    She will be assisting this coming weekend at Empath Empowerment Workshop Level 1.

    So when ISABELLA notices things like this, it is because she has superb skills to harness her talent. A very deep and accurate observation, indeed!

  58. 58

    Aura reading, or doing Skilled Empath Merge, can make such a difference for clarifying what really happens with a person’s state of consciousness.

    To me, ISABELLA, it is utterly fascinating what you have noted about people being — to put it more bluntly — spiritually asleep.

    Remember our thread about Hypnosis OR Meditation. Know the difference ?

    Many a person moves into a religious group or cult where prayer or meditation is offered. Only, oops, hypnotism is supplied.

  59. 59

    So doesn’t that add up beautifully?

    Hypnotism is great for many things. It is the quintessentially human form of personal development.

    You make use of what is already known by you at a subconscious level.

    Your mood can be improved. And that’s just the star of miracles that can happen, thanks to hypnotic power.

  60. 60

    Spiritual development, by contrast, is not about human vibrational frequencies.

    Spiritual development is needed to move a person into Enlightenment.

    Today, BTW, I saw the photo of a leader in the National Guild of Hypnotists. I was pleasantly surprised to research her aura and find her ready for the Enlightenment Life List. I aim to post that latest discovery soon.

    Here’s the beauty part. She doesn’t just do hypnotism. So far, I have only found three hypnotists to go on my Enlightenment Life List, the great Larry Garrett and Dr. Richard Harte, the clinical psychologist who has brought so much to the NGH-Certified Hypnotism Training (that I now offer).

  61. 61

    So, ISABELLA and other Blog-Buddies, putting all this together, how perfect is that!

    Plenty of people who are spiritually asleep and not yet ready to progress…

    Cheerfully fulfill the social requirement of belonging to a religion…

    Perhaps even are fundamentalists within that religion, because every religion does have its version of fundamentalism, right? And fundamentalists (with all respect, in my opinion) hold most tightly to human forms of security.

  62. 62

    Isn’t it quite perfect, then?

    The good citizen, strong churchgoer, perhaps elder in the congregation, etc.

    Has little — or maybe no — readiness for purposeful spiritual evolution yet.

    It’s totally comfortable for such a person to feel good in a group where there is NOTHING in the rituals and rites that brings a spiritual experience. There is, instead, the comfort of hypnotism.

    Gotta love Earth School, Land of Illusions!

  63. 63
    Suz says:

    Thanks, Rose. (And thanks to Isabella for asking the question.)

    You’ve put in words what I have watched in various churches for many years. There are some very talented sleeping folks who do a pretty good fake spiritual experience.

    But if you watch carefully, eventually you can see they’re asleep. And some are dangerous because they know they’re missing “something” and don’t want you blowing their cover. 🙂

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